Lulete Mola’s passion for activism and social justice stems from her love of her family and community. Before co-founding the Black Collective Foundation MN as a result of the pandemic and social uprising in Minnesota, Lulete started her own youth-led organization, worked for the Women’s Foundation of Minnesota and participated on many boards including Minnesota Council of Foundations and the VoteRunLead National Advisory.

In episode 4 of I So Appreciate You!, co-hosts Nadege Souvenir and Melanie Hoffert chat with this special guest and Facing Race Award recipient about her roles as an activist, organizer and philanthropic leader in the community.

With the Black Collective Foundation MN, Lulete and fellow founders Chanda Smith Baker and Repa Meka are shifting the landscape of philanthropy by creating a space for Black-led change.

“The reality is that when Black people lead, all people benefit,” said Lulete. “There is nothing that reassures me more than the work Black folks have done across this globe, time and time and time again. And If someone asks me what is my theory of change, my theory of change is the brilliance of Black people.”

Links

Black Collective Foundation MN

Follow Lulete on Twitter

Nadege Souvenir:

Welcome everyone to I So Appreciate You!, a raw, funny, and uniquely insightful podcast about the issues and opportunities we all face as values-based leaders and humans. I'm Nadege.

Melanie Hoffert:

And I'm Melanie, we're colleagues at the Saint Paul & Minnesota Foundation, and we're friends. When we get together, our conversations can go anywhere, especially when bringing a friend or two along for the ride.

Nadege Souvenir:

So we're inviting you to join us and some incredible guests as we explore the challenges and triumphs of people shaking up our community for the better.

Melanie Hoffert:

Welcome everybody. Today we are going to be talking about Black-led change, specifically as it relates to philanthropy, but I'm sure we'll wander into other areas. And we're going to be joined by special guest Lulete Mola, who's a Co-founder and President of the MN Black Collective Foundation. Nadege, how are you doing today?

Nadege Souvenir:

I'm good. How are you?

Melanie Hoffert:

I'm great.

Nadege Souvenir:

Yeah. So you say Black-led change, and immediately what is happening in my brain is, I'm thinking about Black Panther, which I just saw yesterday.

Melanie Hoffert:

Lucky.

Nadege Souvenir:

I know. It is amazing, but I'm not going to talk about it.

Melanie Hoffert:

Okay.

Nadege Souvenir:

Because I don't know who's listening and when they're listening and when they get to see the movie.

Melanie Hoffert:

Yes.

Nadege Souvenir:

So I don't want to spoil anything, but then it just had me thinking about movies and fun things, which I realize is a bit of a tangent. But what did you do this weekend, Melanie?

Melanie Hoffert:

Oh, goodness. Boy, it's been a busy weekend of house projects and we made brunch, we cooked. We're getting back into cooking for friends and family, because the pandemic shut it down, and I'm really out of practice. But we did some of that. Went on a lot of walks and I also, it was just ahead of the weekend, but was able to be in discussion with a visiting author, our friend Vanessa Bee, who has a new book out called Home Bound, which actually would lend in quite nicely to our discussion today. So that was fun. And I just have to give us a shout-out because being a podcast co-host was really, really helpful in terms of facilitating this discussion in front of a crowd.

Nadege Souvenir:

That's awesome.

Melanie Hoffert:

That's what I've been up to.

Nadege Souvenir:

That's awesome.

Melanie Hoffert:

How about you? What else besides the movie?

Nadege Souvenir:

Well, my weekend was not nearly as wide ranging and cultural as yours. We binge watched Drink Masters.

Melanie Hoffert:

Ooh, is that like a cocktail show?

Nadege Souvenir:

It is a cocktail show on Netflix. And it was fascinating just to watch the thinking and the creativity of people making literally a cocktail. So there was that.

Melanie Hoffert:

That is creative though.

Nadege Souvenir:

Yeah, it is super creative. And then we started another show, speaking about brunch.

Melanie Hoffert:

Yes.

Nadege Souvenir:

Called, Big Brunch. And the only reason I'm talking about this show is because there is a woman on the show who is Haitian, who has my first name.

Melanie Hoffert:

Really?

Nadege Souvenir:

I don't know when I've ever seen somebody on TV named Nadege. It was amazing.

Melanie Hoffert:

That's amazing. Do you want to know something else? In the book that I was just talking about, there is a person in there with your name.

Nadege Souvenir:

Are you kidding?

Melanie Hoffert:

No, no. It Is the weekend of your name, apparently.

Nadege Souvenir:

That is, okay, I feel like I need to go buy a lottery ticket or something because my name is-

Melanie Hoffert:

You missed that window for that big drawing.

Nadege Souvenir:

Listen, I don't need the big one. I just need one.

Melanie Hoffert:

Ooh.

Nadege Souvenir:

You know what?

Melanie Hoffert:

There you go.

Nadege Souvenir:

I'll just take whatever the universe wants to give me, lottery wise, I will take it.

Melanie Hoffert:

All right, all right.

Nadege Souvenir:

So I think on that very lucky and energetic note, I'm looking forward to just diving right into this conversation with Lulete.

Melanie Hoffert:

Yeah, let's get into it. Yes.

Nadege Souvenir:

All right.

Melanie Hoffert:

At the Saint Paul & Minnesota Foundation, we partner with hundreds of nonprofits to support their endowment funds. An endowment is a great way to provide your organization with a stable income for generations to come. If you are interested in learning more about starting an endowment, contact a member of our team by visiting spmcf.org/endowment.

All right. Welcome back everyone. We are very excited to have our special guest today, Lulete Mola. Lulete, how are you doing?

Lulete Mola:

I'm doing well. I am surprisingly happy about the snowfall this morning.

Melanie Hoffert:

Yes, we are recording on a very beautiful, snowy day. So we're almost like in a snow globe, a little bit. It's very magical.

Lulete Mola:

Oh, I like that.

Melanie Hoffert:

Yes. Well, before we jump into the discussion, and Nadege and I have a lot of questions for you, we just want to give our listeners a tiny bit of your backstory. There's much to say, but we've picked out just a couple of highlights. First of all, you're the Co-founder and President of the MN Black Collective Foundation, which is Minnesota's first Black community foundation, which is very exciting to talk about. Secondly, I was just saying before we started recording that I was very excited to watch you on the Foundation's, our Foundation's, Facing Race Awards. You are one of four recipients this year, and our Facing Race Awards each year recognizes those in our community who are really making efforts against the racism in our culture, in our society. And the work you do certainly does that. So thank you for that.

And then we did a little sleuthing and found that at age 15 you created something called SHE, which is an organization that encouraged power building and leadership with girls, particularly Black girls and girls of color. So this is you at 15 and now fast forward, of course, we see the leadership role that you're in today. So super exciting to have you with us.

Lulete Mola:

Yes, thank you for having me.

Nadege Souvenir:

Well, before we dive right in, and I feel like you've told us that you've heard the podcast, so you know we're about to do three quick questions.

Lulete Mola:

Yes.

Nadege Souvenir:

All right. Okay. So are you ready?

Lulete Mola:

I don't know if I'm ready. But I'm here.

Nadege Souvenir:

All right. Here we go. This one's easy, snow or rain?

Lulete Mola:

Rain.

Nadege Souvenir:

Ooh.

Melanie Hoffert:

Ooh.

Lulete Mola:

Absolutely.

Nadege Souvenir:

You said that like, just real smooth. Is there a particular kind of rain that you're a fan of?

Lulete Mola:

I love a good thunderstorm. If I had to describe my mood, it is either sun showers or is it dark thunderstorm filled day.

Melanie Hoffert:

Oh, I that love.

Lulete Mola:

I just love the mood of leaning into what that presents, whether it's a good book, a good show, being inside or even being outside. I just love a good rainy day.

Nadege Souvenir:

You're just painting a picture.

Melanie Hoffert:

I know poetry right there.

Nadege Souvenir:

Right?

Melanie Hoffert:

Poetry, yeah.

Nadege Souvenir:

All right. What's worse, laundry or dishes?

Lulete Mola:

Both is not an answer.

Nadege Souvenir:

Both is my answer.

Lulete Mola:

I would say laundry, because you have to wash it.

Melanie Hoffert:

I agree.

Lulete Mola:

And then you have to put it away. With dishes, you could wash it and then set it out neatly to dry and then you could walk away and someone else can put it away. I don't put dishes away. I wash them and then put them to the side.

Nadege Souvenir:

I'm with you.

Melanie Hoffert:

100%.

Lulete Mola:

And then they get used, right?

Melanie Hoffert:

Yes.

Lulete Mola:

So laundry.

Nadege Souvenir:

Okay, fair enough.

Lulete Mola:

Yes.

Nadege Souvenir:

I can appreciate that.

Lulete Mola:

Yes.

Nadege Souvenir:

The ocean or the mountains?

Lulete Mola:

The ocean.

Nadege Souvenir:

Oh yeah? Okay. So is that related to the rain and the water? Do you have a connection with water?

Lulete Mola:

I do love water.

Nadege Souvenir:

You and Melanie have that in common.

Lulete Mola:

Oh yes?

Melanie Hoffert:

Yeah. I'm writing a book on water right now.

Lulete Mola:

You are?

Melanie Hoffert:

Yes.

Lulete Mola:

Oh, that's cool. Yeah, I love the ocean. Who doesn't? Right? Also where I'm from, we are sun people, East Africa, Ethiopia. So we didn't necessarily have access to the ocean, but lakes and seas. So the ocean reminds me of all of that.

Nadege Souvenir:

Oh, that's really wonderful.

Melanie Hoffert:

Beautiful.

Nadege Souvenir:

All right, so as Melanie said, you are the Co-founder and President of the MN Black Collective Foundation.

Lulete Mola:

Yes.

Nadege Souvenir:

And so I want to chat, we want to chat about that a lot, not just a little bit, but I want to give a little context. So for those of our listeners who don't know, can you tell us a little bit about the origins of this foundation?

Lulete Mola:

Yes, I can. So let's start with, none of us saw COVID-19 coming.

Nadege Souvenir:

No, we did not.

Melanie Hoffert:

Right.

Lulete Mola:

Or the uprising for racial justice that was ignited by the murder of George Floyd, may he rest in peace. Which was actually more nationally and internationally renowned. But if you've been rooted here you know that we've had many local community uprisings against racial injustice. I got into this work not because I dreamt of a career in racial justice or a career in philanthropy. I got into this work because I loved my family so much. I love my neighbors so much. I love my community so much. And it confused me and frustrated me that the world did not love and honor my people the way I loved and honored my people. And so it was natural for me to do something about it. When the uprising happened, I was at the Women's Foundation of Minnesota as the Chief Strategy and Innovation Officer. The way I entered philanthropy was untraditional.

It was almost by accident. I was already doing this work in community and then this opportunity came up at the Women's Foundation and so I entered it. And so my perspective of how I made decisions or moved in the sector was always informed by the movement for Black lives. But often I felt split. I felt like when I was in philanthropy, I was a representative of community. And I think many of us feel this way. We're seen with within multiple identities. So the way I occupy a position is very different than someone else who doesn't have those same relationships and presence and connections and community. But then when I was in community, I would have this label of funder on me. And so it always felt odd because one, I didn't know how to reconcile both. I just knew that I existed in both spaces.

And so when the uprising came, and just like before, I would be in the streets in the morning and be making grant decisions that afternoon, in the same day. And would have to level myself from high emotions, high rage, high frustration to being even tempered, changing your mindset, because the two, while rooted in the same values, take different parts of your brain. So again, when the uprising happened, I examined my proximity to power and that was clearly the sector of philanthropy. And I reached out to my co-founders, Repa Mekha and Chanda Smith Baker, who were also invested and moved in philanthropy, far greater time than I have been in the sector, from different experiences of Blackness than mine. And then highly influential in both the sector of philanthropy and community. And the three of us said, okay, what can we do to ask philanthropy to not just express empathy, but really engage in power shifting solidarity and transformation.

And so we wrote a letter basically saying, hey, we don't know exactly what we're going to do, but we know we have to do something. And are you in to be part of this philanthropic collective? Our original name, To Combat Anti-Blackness and Realize Racial Justice and us even saying anti-Blackness, right? Being very specific to what was happening, naming it, defining it, not letting vague words such as diversity, equity, and inclusion be the terms that define the moment. But actually calling things what they were, that was transformational. Or putting forth racial justice, not just racial equity, because both exist on a spectrum, but saying, are we committed to racial justice? Are we also committed to understanding what led to that nine-minute video of George Floyd pleading for his life, is not necessarily only the police officers that were there or policing, is actually multiple sectors and multiple narratives and systems that work together to create that very moment. And we're all, either complicit in that system or we can do something about that system. So are we really about it? And that's how the work got started.

Nadege Souvenir:

Wow there's so much to unpack.

Lulete Mola:

It's a lot.

Melanie Hoffert:

Yeah. I've been taking notes, like boy, where to jump in? Nadege, you okay if I-

Nadege Souvenir:

Yeah, go for it.

Melanie Hoffert:

Take one of these threads. Thank you, Lulete for sharing that story and your origin story. One thing that stood out to me is the way you describe the pressure of being both, and. like you're in an institution and seen as a representative and having to carry that weight and also being out in the community and having to carry that weight of representing an institution. It's this circular thing. There are very unique pressures that I think someone who's in my body wouldn't feel as they would in yours. But I want to now ask my question, which is, now you're moving into this new space as a co-founder and that has its own unique pressures, starting something new, charting the way, having both the freedom and the pressure to be a first in this area is also loaded. And I'm just curious if you can just speak a little bit about what you're early on in this journey, what you're finding or facing from that perspective.

Lulete Mola:

Yeah, I appreciate you naming that, because the pressure is real. But there is two sides of a coin. It's pressure and a gift. Even going back to occupying the positions that we're occupying. It is a gift to be able to walk into a room and bring all my people with me. It is a gift to come from where I come from and be proud of that and get to tell people, we don't only exist in our tragedies, we don't only exist in the statistics that are published every year. Minnesota has the worst disparities. We also come from very vibrant and loving homes and no one loves us more than our family and more than our neighbors and our community. So it is a gift. Then the other side of that is, it is pressure. Because when I walk into the room, I am cognizant that I don't only represent myself, I represent many. Whether I choose to or not in that moment.

And so the way I conduct myself, the way I communicate, the things that I get done is a reflection of both the people that have poured into me and the people who've come before me and the people that will come after me. And so being a co-founder, the first thing I'll say is I am so thankful I'm not alone. I'm so thankful there are two other brilliant, brilliant people who I consider almost like family. That are by my side, who carry gifts that I may not necessarily have. So I'm thankful that I don't have to feel this pressure alone, but I can build with my co-founders, who I greatly respect and admire. The second thing is, we're also facing what a lot of Black-led organizations are facing. Whether it's doubts, even though we prove ourselves or anti-Blackness. Just general mistrust of what we're doing and how we're doing it.

Or the constant pressure to prove ourselves or having to perform, to be magical with minimal resources. So that sometimes it does keep me up at night, I'm not going to lie. And from the beginning, the fact that we didn't come out with a strategic plan and a five point vision on how to go from A to B, if you know me, I am very prepared. I don't necessarily operate like that in my work, but this work required us to be emergent, to lean into what is happening in real time and lean in, to dig deep into history that you can't always see, but you can always feel. And to put forward a new path that we actually may not have necessarily seen ourselves. And keeping me up at night, what has helped me sleep is, and I know we're going to talk about it, is the unequivocal belief I have in the genius of Black-led change.

There is nothing that reassures me more than the work Black folks have done across this globe, time and time and time again. And if someone asks me, what is your theory of change? My theory of change is the brilliance of Black people and the way that we've moved mountains and the way that we've not only engaged in historical anti-colonial struggles, but also just right here in the US, from fighting against slavery, to the civil rights movement, to recently the movement for Black lives or the amazing work we see every single day. The reality of the matter is, when Black people lead, all people benefit. And so even though these pressures are hard to carry, I try to lean into the real work I've witnessed firsthand and I can read about and I can learn about knowing that I am not alone, knowing that I am not the first, a lot of people have come before me, strategically creating foundations that you can't necessarily name, but existed.

While we are the first community foundation focused on all Black people in Minnesota, Black folks in philanthropy have been moving resources for years. They just did it strategically. They met after the meeting to say, okay, how can we present this in a way that could be acceptable? Sometimes having to water down race in order for people to accept it. So there's been a lot of creative ways, resources have been distributed and so knowing that we're building off of work that has come before us and then this work is beyond us, also humbles me greatly. Both affirming that I am important, but only as important as my people as a whole.

Melanie Hoffert:

Right. And I just want to underscore one thing, Nadege, before you jump in. The collective, because you're very intentional with your language, we can tell. And I think that just in that name, everything you said brings that piece of this foundation to life.

Nadege Souvenir:

Yeah. So, I love that, the genius of Black-led change. But I want to play with that phrase, Black-led, because you've been in the philanthropic space, you probably know every couple of years somebody wants to do a survey or study about how we're funding organizations. And then there's a big debate, how do you define if an organization is Black-led? Is it the one person at the top? What does that mean? And so I'd love for you to articulate what you understand as Black-led, because I feel like I can feel it, but nobody can hear that on the show. So, ask you to talk about it a little bit.

Lulete Mola:

Yeah, I appreciate, and that is a very important question. So we say Black-led change is the social, political and economic change led by diverse groups of Black people. And in that we acknowledge that there is not a monolithic Black people. We are very diverse. And that's the gift of having a Black community foundation, because now we can actually look at culture, we could look at gender, we could look at age, we could look at immigration, we could look at the various ways Black people are diverse within our communities and resource and amplify solutions related to the intersecting identities that we have. Black-led change centers the power, interest and wellbeing of Black communities and like I said earlier, often benefiting all people. I believe Black-led change is rooted in cultural practices across generations and across the diaspora. It reflects the inherent dignity and vision of Black people.

So when Black-led change is only rooted in our harm and is only rooted in all of the things that are wrong with us, I don't think that's Black-led change. I think that's change about Black people. But if you know us, which we do, we know that we're more than our struggles. When my mom has began together with her sister, she's not talking about all of the ways the world has kicked her down today. They're talking about food, they're talking about children, they're talking about their dreams. So Black-led change has to incorporate both the dreams, the visions of Black folks, in addition to the hardships and the things that we have to overcome.

And what's important about Black-led changes, while it continues to prove its impact and necessity, historically it's been targeted and it's been under resourced and undervalued. And so to say Black-led change is genius is revolutionary because we're claiming our rightful place in history, saying change led by Black people, for Black people, centering our wellbeing and centering our full identities is a way that improves the world for all people. And just even that narrative change can be monumental for our population that doesn't hear those messages every day.

Nadege Souvenir:

I really appreciate the narrative that you're talking about because on one hand it's super basic. See me entirely. Don't just see my flaws, don't just see my challenges, but see the joy, the happiness, all of that. But on the other hand, we don't hear it enough. It's not in the space and to your point, when your mom gets together with friends or sisters, whomever, we know it. But why do we have to be the only ones talking about it?

Lulete Mola:

I want to affirm what you said about, it's simple and yet we don't receive those messages. And I wholeheartedly believe it's on purpose. You get into the narratives of how people see themselves and see each other. And you get into the soul of how change does or doesn't happen. We are brilliant, we are capable, we make history. We deserve to be resourced at our capacity, because we're already changing the world with the little resources that we have. Imagine what we can do if we are seen in our full light. And so the narrative that we get every day, including in philanthropy, whenever we are being defined by our deficits and the assets are nowhere, we should be able to call that out and say, I appreciate this research report, but it's missing a lot. We have to start demanding full narratives of people. And that's a big part of social change that I think now is getting more recognized, but historically not necessarily has been as valued. So I just want to affirm that.

Melanie Hoffert:

I love what you said, especially as a storyteller, a writer and a marketer with a foundation, this demanding full narratives. Because I do think we have these phrases that we use to try to define need in different communities and it's really usually deficit based. And we as a team have been reflecting on it. So I just want to underscore that. But my question is about where the foundation is and is it going to look similar to what we might think of as a foundation's purpose and mission and just in terms of traditional grant making or how you intervene in the community. So I just want to know the nuts and bolts at this stage in the collective's early history.

Lulete Mola:

So 2020 to November 2021, actually tomorrow's my one year.

Melanie Hoffert:

Congratulations.

Lulete Mola:

Anniversary.

Nadege Souvenir:

We're celebrating.

Lulete Mola:

We've been working intentionally to emerge, to find out who we are. Because we didn't set out and say we were going to create a Black foundation. We said we have to do something beyond the moment. We have to invite power shifting solidarity. And then with time we realize, we actually have to build Black power around philanthropy. Whether it's claiming that inherent ways we are philanthropic. I often refer to the Kellogg Foundation study, I think early 2010s that found that Black people give the most of their income away. Even if you think about Black folks who go to church and do 10% tithes, that's more than what the IRS regulates to private foundations.

Nadege Souvenir:

Absolutely.

Lulete Mola:

Or foundations, period. So we are a philanthropic people. We just do it in a different way. Whether we give to church or the mosque or you give to your cousin or your family or you send it to your home country, you're still giving, it's just not systemized.

Nadege Souvenir:

It's not institutionalized.

Lulete Mola:

It's not institutionalized in the way we define philanthropy. So part of our work is harnessing that giving and institutionalizing it. We realize we have to, building an endowment is a form of community wealth. So we often talk about individual wealth building or family wealth building. What about community wealth building? Very few Black organizations in this nation and even fewer in the state to raise almost $5 million and we've given out over 1 million in what we're calling creative grant making. And then the other part I want to highlight is this work around narrative shifting and research. So we are working with the Center for Evaluation and Innovation and other partners in the sector nationally to create a baseline. Where is Minnesota when it comes to giving to Black-led change as we defined and as defined by community? Where are we when it comes to giving to racial justice? Where do we want to be?

A lot of articles came out around what companies pledge versus what has come out. We want to do it in an encouraging way because we do want to partner with folks. And that's why we've moved from even the terminology, from accountability to power shifting solidarity. Because when you're in power shifting solidarity, it's not just that you're standing by us, you're standing by us and willing to share the power that you have so that we also have power in the sector. We just went through our community builders practice, so instead of program, we call the various things that we do, practices, because practices make an organization and it influences the DNA of an org, where programs can come and go. So everything that we're doing is influencing who we're becoming in real time. It's important that we fund underground work.

So work that you can't necessarily see, but you can feel. Work that you can't Google, but you know many families that have been impacted by that elder, many families that have been impacted by this initiative. Maybe work that hasn't had the infrastructure to put together beautiful pamphlets and write op-eds in the Star Tribune.

Nadege Souvenir:

That's because they're doing the work.

Lulete Mola:

They're doing the work, but everybody in the neighborhood knows them. So we focused on underground work, we focused on both larger organizations, legacy organizations and new organizations. And so now we funded these 15 organizations as the first cohort of our Black-led change partners. But here's the thing, we gave 50,000 to the organizations and then we're giving 10,000 to the leaders of the organizations. Because we recognize how much leaders have to sacrifice in order to keep their work running.

Nadege Souvenir:

You worked at a community foundation. We work at a community foundation. I think if you go back to the history of all of our community foundations, they're formed and it's a whole number of years before grant goes out. So I just have to go ahead and say kudos that in year one as a community foundation, you already got money out the door. Because that's a big deal. That's very different than how community foundations usually grow. And so I love that. I think that's so powerful. One of the things that I want to ask you about is joy. You are doing some big work and I can see it physically, because I'm looking at you, but I know people can hear it in your tone, because your voice has been, it's melodically up and down as you get passionate about something. But I want to know, when you step away from the work, what brings you joy right now? What makes you happy? What makes you smile?

Lulete Mola:

Oh, I like that. I love standup comedy. I think we talked about this. I'm a big Martin Lawrence and Def Jam Comedy. You could find it on Amazon.

Nadege Souvenir:

I love it.

Lulete Mola:

I love the good standup, old Eddie Murphy. I love standup comedy and I'm actually, there's such a difference between how you experience me personally and professionally and I'm trying to merge the two. Because personally I'm all about a good time. I talk a lot of stuff. I crack jokes.

Nadege Souvenir:

I've never experienced that with you.

Lulete Mola:

Listen that's-

Nadege Souvenir:

I'm kidding. I'm giving you grief.

Lulete Mola:

Yes. So see? That now we've crossed a friendship line, that's a good thing. We're closer. And the profession, I feel like I got to be serious, because about that, I want to make sure I'm doing my work right and I'm doing right by my people. So I don't always feel like I could be my goofy self. So I love to just let go and laugh. I love podcasts. The Read is a fave of mine. I love fashion and pop culture. I love to spend time with my friends, my partner, and my 11 year old bonus son. I just like to kick it. Outside of work, I'm just like, time is a social construct. I don't really do schedules on the weekend because I like to free myself from the pressures of work. Outside of work I love to live in a free undefined world and I don't even talk about my work a lot in my personal life, because again, I'm trying to live authentically me, authentically Black.

I'm not trying to define it and write about it. I'm just trying to be. So that's what brings me joy, when I get to just be.

Nadege Souvenir:

I love that so much. And I also love that whether you realize it or not, you are echoing some themes from some of our other guests.

Lulete Mola:

Oh really?

Melanie Hoffert:

Yes you are.

Nadege Souvenir:

About really just making the space for the wholeness of your life. Because none of us can do the work that we do, whatever it is really, honestly, whatever it is, without filling our own tanks.

Melanie Hoffert:

Well just to bring this back around, it's so hard to let you go, because we have so much to talk about and could sit here for hours. I've been so lucky to learn from you today and I really appreciate you being here.

Lulete Mola:

Thank you, I appreciate that. And thank you for having questions outside of my notes.

Nadege Souvenir:

Did we push it?

Lulete Mola:

About joy and the rain. Because I do, I dream of a life for me where I can be fully myself and I don't always know how to do that. So when people give me that space and encourage me, that's when I step into it. Because I don't always think about stepping into it myself. So I appreciate this platform. I so appreciate you.

Nadege Souvenir:

Oh.

Melanie Hoffert:

On that note.

Nadege Souvenir:

On that note, thank you so much.

Lulete Mola:

Yes, thank you.

Nadege Souvenir:

Wow.

Melanie Hoffert:

I'd say.

Nadege Souvenir:

That was a masterclass that we didn't know we were going to get in narrative change. From start to finish, I don't even have words, Melanie. I don't have words.

Melanie Hoffert:

I'm with you. I'm just looking at my notes. Demanding full narratives, she asked of us all. And I think that what we heard from her is painting that full narrative. I don't know a lot about her writing or storytelling like her as a person, but if she doesn't-

Nadege Souvenir:

She needs her own show.

Melanie Hoffert:

I was just going to say.

Nadege Souvenir:

Her own situation. We need The Lulete Show, where she's speaking truth to power and telling everyone what they need to know, because the lyricalness and the poetry in which she delivered so many complicated and deep truths in this conversation. I can't.

Melanie Hoffert:

I agree. I think we should shout-out her Facing Race segment. If someone hasn't watched it, go to facingrace.org and you'll be able to see her story in real time in a beautiful form. We get to meet some of her family members, we get to see them making coffee. So I am now officially a fan.

Nadege Souvenir:

I think it was just great, everyone just dig in, listen to it again and just learn. That's all I can say. Just learn. Thank you for listening to, I So Appreciate You! You can find us on Facebook @ISoAppreciateYouPodcast, and on Twitter and Instagram @soappreciateyou.

Melanie Hoffert:

We'd also appreciate you taking a moment to write us a review. If you like our show, be sure to follow I So Appreciate You! on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you're listening to us right now.

Nadege Souvenir:

Have a question or topic suggestion? Email us at podcast@spmcf.org. Thank you for listening to I So Appreciate You!